The Writing Apothecary Podcast
A podcast about tips, tricks and hacks on all things writing with your host Mandi Kontos - a writer, writing mindset coach and self published author. Each month we tackle a different topic to do with writing and follow it up with a chat with a guest who will put things into perspective and finish off the topic. The Writing Apothecary is the podcast to help you understand the different layers of a novel, one topic at a time.
The Writing Apothecary Podcast
The Writing Process with JA Jude
Today's Writing Process episode is with paranormal author JA Jude who is not only a fabulous author but also a talented artist. She draws all of her own art and does her covers, which is absolutely stunning!
Through all of these podcast I ask the same questions and get such different responses from every one of my guests, which is why I love writers so damn much.
Jude's approach is chaotic but so poetic. I would love to know what you think about it.
About JA Jude:
J.A. Jude is a Melbourne-based indie author and artist who creates for the dreamers out there.
Sick of wondering ‘what if’, she began putting her love for writing and creating into writing her own book. A sucker for love and escapism, her stories are centred around romance with strong elements of the supernatural and fantasy worlds that shaped much of her life from a young age.
She loves writing books that have that conversational, best friend tone that feels like they’re spilling all the tea.
Links:
https://www.etsy.com/au/shop/LuckorMoxie
Amazon Supernova AU - https://www.amazon.com.au/dp/0645818305
Amazon Stargazer AU - https://www.amazon.com.au/dp/0645818321
Amazon Supernova US - https://www.amazon.com/dp/0645818305
Amazon Stargazer US - https://www.amazon.com/dp/0645818321
Follow her on:
Tiktoke @authorjajude
Instagram: @byjajude
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If you're looking for a cheerleader for your writing, then head on over to https://dreamingfullyawake.com/work-with-me/ and let's have a chat about how we can work together to get your writing on track.
Follow the podcast on Instragram @thewritingapothecary
Follow Mandi on all socials: @mandikont
Hello there and welcome to the Writing Apothecary, a podcast with tips, tricks, hacks, and information about all things writing. I'm your host, Mandy Contos, and together with some awesome guests, we'll uncover the weird, wonderful, and sometimes unpredictable world of writing. So, grab your notebook, grab a pen, or a tablet, or maybe even just listen and let's get started. Hey guys, welcome back to the writing apothecary. And today we have the lovely JA Jude, who also goes by Janice. Um, how are you going today? I'm good, I'm good, I'm excited. Yeah, I can't wait to dig into your writing process. It's been so fun to kind of go along and see how everyone is slightly different and then very similar in some some of the the very weird ways that we are similar. Yeah. Oh my god, they're wonderful. All right, so I guess first things first, are you a pantser or a plotter? Um, or are you something in between? Take us through what you kind of think you are as. Yeah, I I think I'm definitely in between.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think I started so with supernova, I was definitely more of a pantser. Um, I had like an overarching idea of like the plot, like very few dot points. But then from there, I essentially just kind of wrote and I wrote it over like a long period of time. So it was very like when things came in my head, I would just jot them down. I think I started with like the end and then like worked backwards. Um, so I very much was just filling in the holes and just writing what I felt at the time. Like it was very vibe and mood-based. Um, so yeah, very much more prepared. Yeah, what about I guess because that was Supernova's Your First Book. What about Star? Is it Stargazer? Stargazer. Stargazer.
Speaker 1:What about Stargazer? Was that different again or was that quite similar?
Speaker 2:No, I think I I think as I went to go start Stargazer, I went with the same sort of pansom mindset. And then I was like really struggling. I was like, I like don't know how to get into this story. And I was kind of panicked. I was like, oh my god, I have to write a second book. Like, how does this work? How does it flow? And because of that, I needed to like sit down and actually like fully brainstorm, which was really weird for me. I was like, this is this is odd. Um, so yeah, I had to like sit and kind of I think make like a list of questions that needed to be answered from book one. And obviously, you know, now that there's like a plot, there's like a story that needs to progress. So I felt like I couldn't just sit and write. I needed to have a bit of more of a guideline. Um so I also sort of wrote down like for more important parts, I'd have like sort of a chapter header and little dot points, but then I still sort of pantsed in terms of like how it came together was very much just how I felt at the time. Like I still wrote the scenes as they came to me, like I'd have shower thoughts and like write them down and then you know fledge them out. Um, but yeah, definitely more of a combination. It still wasn't like fully planned, and like I still like to have that freedom of just writing whatever I feel, especially with specific scenes happen, but how they happen is very much just on the fly. And then I kind of connect all the pieces. So I guess I'm kind of like, is it a plant ser?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, there's I'm totally a plant ser. So I was just like, I like to do very loose plotting with a lot of just like letting the characters go. Yeah. Is that the same with book three? Because you're currently writing that one right now.
Speaker 2:Yes, I am. Yeah. So it's yeah, the same for that one. That's the same approach that I'm taking. It's like there was a big brainstorm at the start, and then from here it's kind of just writing it as I feel, but I sort of use those dot points to make sure I'm reining it in and not going off on like tangents.
Speaker 1:Yep, yep. But it still happens though, the characters have a mind of their own, and you're like, no, we're not meant to be doing that.
Speaker 2:Exactly. And I like the creative like freedom of being able to let them sort of speak for themselves and write their own story and then edit things as I need to sort of make it fit. Yep, cool. I guess the next question is how do you then start writing? Is there some kind of ritual that sets the tone, or is it something that you kind of just jump into all guns blazing and kind of go from there? Or is there some kind of, I guess, I don't know, system to it? I don't think I have a system or anything because I'm very much like a mood writer. I feel like I just kind of write whenever. If I'm writing during the day, which I try to do more because if I write at night, I literally can't stop thinking about my book and I won't go to sleep. And yeah, I'll be like literally coming up with scenes and I gotta bring my laptop out. So I try to write more in the day. Um, and if I am writing in the day, I like to sort of move around my house to find the sunlight. So I'm like a little cat. I'm like, where's the natural light? Give me a I love that. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Um in your car. I keep seeing all of your like Instagram posts where you're like and I'm like, I'm envious.
Speaker 2:I love writing in the car. That's probably like the only little routine if I feel stuck. I have myself a coffee, I'll find somewhere to park if there's a view, even better. But I just feel like it helps me not be so distracted. I'm not like, you know, oh, I'll just go put the washing up, or like I just like sit and write, and I kind of use it as I guess little writing sprint where I'll sit for like an hour and just write, right, right. And it just, I don't know, it makes me feel a lot more focused. Yeah. Um, sometimes it's just that whole, yeah, the whole thing of getting out of your normal, I guess, environment and being like, well, now I can actually just focus on that one thing and then be able to actually get the words out because you're like, oh, I don't have to do this and I don't have to do that, and I don't have to feed this person, or like make sure that the cat is fed and the dog has water. I don't know, like you know, it's all of that. Exactly. Yeah. I feel like when I'm in that bubble, like the only thing that I'm kind of thinking about is like, oh, I could like film a little bit for content.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:But apart from that, it's just like, okay, let's just write. And like I've got nothing else to do. So I just get it done. And yeah, it's I don't know, it's really nice. I find it really therapeutic.
Speaker 1:Yeah, nice. Nice. Okay, well then how does I guess, you know, because you've started your story, how does the story then evolve? Is there a certain method that you use? Is there something that kind of works with it, or is it just kind of you just have those points and go with it?
Speaker 2:Um, I think I mostly just sort of go with it. Um, I think for me, like a big part of evolving my story was making sure that the characters were evolving. Um, so throughout the process of these three books, you know, I'm thinking about okay, Venus, how was she in book one with supernova? And then how are like the little plot points that are happening throughout the way going to change that? I feel like it was really important for me to like take the readers on that sort of journey with her growth. And then the same with Griffin and River, who are like two main male main characters. Um, I wanted to make sure each of them had a bit of growth as well. And I think that helped the story evolve, sort of focusing on them and how they're evolving. Um, but yeah, with book two and three, I feel like there's a lot more plot. So that brainstorming that I said that I did helped really, I guess, hone in on that. And then I don't know, like I sort of spiral. Once I like start thinking of an idea, I just like keep snowballing. Yeah, like I'll have like the randomest idea pop up and oh wait, that connects really well, and that would just make that story work so much better. Um, but I also tried in my early stages of supernova and even throughout Stargazer to leave like things not like vague, but like to sort of plant lots of little clues and hints. And that way when I'm getting to like the end of the story now in book three, I'm sort of like analyzing which of those parts would be like the most intriguing as a story. Um yeah, it kind of just snowballs.
Speaker 1:I love that, it's so fun. And I think like a lot of the time is that you know, when you're writing, you kind of think about how you have to also trust the reader, like you're evolving this story and you don't want to plot it out too much or like have too much little bits and pieces, because then it's kind of like, oh, well, then what are they gonna come to terms with when they're reading it and how do they like get to that plot point as well? So then, like obviously, you've got one point where you're going with it, and then they're like, oh, well, what about this? And this happens, and it's all of those kind of like assumptions that they make, which I think is really fun. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:It is fun. I have found, I think with book two, when I was brainstorming, I used Miller Note and I was doing like a digital brainstorm. I love Miller Note, and it was so like just nice to be able to like put my ideas down, but also like move the cards around and link everything, and that really helped, I think, the story evolve from what it was in book one to what it gets to in book two with more of the plot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, amazing. That's fun. Yeah. Next question is how many drafts do you aim to have for each story? Because I know it's one of the things is as a writer, we can sit there, right? Cool, we've got our, you know, stream of consciousness draft, which is always to us very perfect, but it is a hundred percent not perfect. Um, how does it, I guess, go from there? Is there a specific thing you look at in your drafting process? Um, yeah, let us tell us all. I feel like my process is probably so far from being like, I think it's very entry-level, it's very just go with the flow. But I think that just works for me. And I'm the type of person that if I overthink things too much, I just won't do it. So for me, it's just like get it and try to make it as perfect as possible. But obviously, it's not ever going to be perfect, and I'm a perfectionist, so that's hard to like let go of. Um, but in terms of drafting, I I've seen so many people say not to do this, and that's like edit while you're drafting your first. Yes, don't do that. Do you do that? I I need to. For me, no, no, this is why it's taking you so long. No, no more editing. It has taken me so long, but it gets me in the mind space, like mindset that I need to be in. Like, I it helps me dig back into the story. So, like, I can't just like write. I like even when I go to sit to start my writing, I like to reread what I previously wrote because I need to like get back into headspace. I need to figure out like where I was going with that train of thought and that process. So, like, I spend a lot of time rewriting. Um, oh my god, my like, oh my like little coaching brain was like, what are you doing? No. Do you know what I actually tell my clients? And I actually um I was just like, get a little notebook and write down like that what you've actually written in your last session. And that way, instead of reading what you wrote, you actually read the summary, and then the summary means you can then jump back into it. Like, oh but I need it. I need to. Oh my god. Oh no, it works for me though. Like it is, it does take a long time, it does take a long time, but then my editing is quicker because I'm so critical as I'm writing my first draft. My brain hurts for you because I was like, if I was doing that for my first draft right now, I know I love it. Yeah, no, I know, I know, I know everyone says it, but I'm like, I don't know, it works for me. It works for me. But because of that, yeah, I probably only do like two drafts and then like a final, like two big drafts, yeah, and then like sort of a final proofreading grammar sort of draft, but then that one keeps going because like I always just find more mistakes. It's never ending, even when it's published, you're like, fuck, I found a mistake. I thought I oh I get so mad because I found more mistakes. But I was like, now I don't know if I'm working with an older edition or a newer edition, and I can't remember which one is. Yeah, it's it's actually the worst. Like it makes me so mad, and then it makes me feel like, oh my god, like it's not good enough to be out because there's still mistakes, but like no matter how much you do, it's like they just magically appear. I I feel like they it's one of those stubborn things that just like you're like you're trying to get rid of us, but we're gonna stay, and then it'll be there. Then everyone's like, Hey, have you seen this? And then you're like, No, and you're like, Yeah god. Oh no, I know, but frustrating. Yeah, it is, it is the worst. I try to just with my drafts, not really like focus on how many I'm doing, whatever. I kind of just go with what feels right for that story. I definitely feel like with Stargazer, I probably spent more time editing and getting it good before releasing. With Supernova, I sort of went and released the ebook version quite early on. And then when I was getting it, the paper went through it again and did even more like small updates and stuff. And yeah, so it depends. But I think it's it's I'm slowly honing it in as I get through this process of figuring out how to write more than both. I think that's funny is that we start out we're like, well, just write one book and then don't think past it. Then we're like, uh oh, we have to write more. And the second book is so hard. So I like I don't know how the third book is. Is the third book harder than the second book or is it easier? Um, there's like I'm scared. It's scary. It's scary. There's a lot of it feels like there's an end, and how do I make that interesting, but also make sure everything's answered, but also yeah, there's there's like a lot. I think initially I kind of just thought my third book would be like really simple, just like a quick end. And as I've gotten to it, I'm like, no, there's a lot that's not needs to happen, and I've found like so many sort of different elements to add into it, and yeah, it's it's very scary. It is very scary, but I don't know what was scarier, to be honest. All of it, all of it, yeah, the whole thing, the whole thing. Okay, I guess then what goes into um and what does your editing process look like then as a result? Like, is it do you like pick, I guess, specific things to look at when you're editing because you've already done that first sort of glance over through those first drafts? Um, is there something that kind of you I guess want to hit with each editing pass through or what? Um so even though I do all that editing as I'm going, I think that editing is more it's it's smaller. It's not like I'm like rewriting whole entire bits or anything like that in the first sort of draft. I'm more so just like, okay, how could that line be a little bit better? Or like finding like spelling mistakes, finding grammar issues, like the small little things. Um and then when I go to do my second edit, which is like the big edit, um I do a lot more like critical, critical editing. So like I generally, I think for the first book, I did it a little bit differently. I like I like to look at it as a reader. So I generally save it from that document. And with book one, I saved it as an e-book first, and then went through and read it as a reader, as a very critical reader who's like harshly judging everything. This is shit and finish it and just get on with it. Exactly. Which I'm not like that as a reader, so it's like because it's your own book, though, you can be like so like subjective with it, and you're like, okay, I can make this better. How do I make it better? Exactly. So I'll go through and I'll like make all these notes and highlight things and all that sort of stuff. And then I went and made those edits and then I like printed it and went through it again. But I think I really honed it in for book two, and instead of doing all that, I sort of finished my draft. I then went and did my cover, which, like, because I do all my own art, I like took that moment to like step away from it and um make my cover, and then I actually printed it straight as so it was like the physical book, and I saved so much money doing that instead of going to like office works and printing it in like A4, which cost me so much money. This worked really well for me. Yeah, so I then I had it as a physical book. I literally went in with like a red pen and I like wrote all over it. I very much used sticky notes, and like I would add extra parts on the sticky notes and put them in on those pages and like mark little plot holes that I found and all that sort of stuff, and just like went through like with a fine tooth comb and like really tore it apart. And then I went and met up with like my alpha reader, and we spent like a whole day going through every single one of those sticky notes and just kind of being like, Does this work? Is that better or worse? Um, I think sometimes I'm like so critical that like I'll talk to her as well and she'll be like, No, I don't think you need to do that. But I'll be like, I do, I do. I think I do, like I think it would just make it be better. So like I'm glad that I can look at it to that sort of level of like not being like, oh my god, I don't want to touch it, yeah, and just kind of like actually work on it. But yeah, we would talk through everything and then I go back, write it all out, like fix the actual uh copy of the document. Um, and then I think I then saved it as an ebook and read it like that, and then sort of did like proofreading, grammar, all that sort of stuff, rephrasing lines a little bit. But that second copy was like very much like big changes, like moving things around. Like I would get those sticky notes and be like, okay, maybe I can move this to another fully fully different page or a different chapter, or like yeah, just sort of reworking it. But yeah. Well, my brain is still on the fact that you printed out a book. Did you do it through Amazon? Like you got like a author copy through there and you just went through it that way. Yeah. Oh my god, you just saved yourself like 70 bucks. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it cost me nine dollars to print it as a proof copy. Oh my god. So I just put like the like the date like so in advance, so like there's no way that it would do anything. Yeah, yeah. Um I even needed to put the date in. I can't even. And I don't think you even need to, like, you just and then I just print it as a proof copy. I think I'm gonna do that now because like that's always a struggle. Because I remember it used to be so much cheaper to do it through OfficeWorks, and then like it's been a while since I went there, and like um my bestie was like, It's like 80 bucks to print it at Office Works. So I'm like, excuse me. She's like, Yep. And I was like, that's not even worth it because you're just gonna scribble all over it, and it's not like a proper document. Like, you just you need something that's like rough. Yeah, yeah. That's what I did with book one, and then I think I also printed like a second copy because like me and my mom, like, we actually work through it a lot together. Like, so I have my Alfarina and then I had my mom, and like I love that. Like throughout my whole writing process, like every time I write a chapter, I like I read it to mom and be like, what do you think? And like I just get her like opinion and see how like she reacts to it, and it would be um not whatever you want to call it. Um, and I printed it from Office Works, I printed her a copy of that too. Yeah, so it cost me so much money. I was like, this is so bad. This time, proof copy $12, $9 each, and it was like, yeah, it saved me so much time. And it was nice to see it as a book and just I don't know, it's really fun. I've got like that copy that's on my shelf, and it's literally just got red markings and how fun. That's so fun. Like, at least you're like, look, because a lot of the time you print copies, like I've got two of mine because I've got like a fake cover, and then I have the actual cover, and I was like, What are you gonna do with these proof copies? Like, you've gone through it and you're like, Oh, they're just you know, they're there, they don't really do much, and then you're like, Oh, cool, like that's such a way, like a great way to use it. Yeah, that's amazing. Okay, I guess I'm totally gonna go do that now. I'm like, wow, like that'll save me so much money, and I can see it physically, and then I can actually make it make sense. Like, that's cool. Yeah. Yes. All right, I guess then. So, like when you go from the first draft to like your second draft, how does that look like and what does that redrafting process, I guess, kind of feel like when it's stretched out? Because I know obviously you go through and edit it, but do you like roughly like read do you rewrite stuff really well like straight away, or is it something that you kind of leave? Like, how does it work? Yeah, well, I think that like read-through with how much editing I do takes a long time. Um, and then by the time I then go back to make those edits, I end up rewriting a lot of stuff. Not everything, like it's more so the problem areas that I will find. Like, I'm not like rewriting everything because I think I've generally write things quite like my sentences and everything are quite established from that first draft that it's more just like making sure that that flows or that's the best way to write it, or that's the easiest way. Like I read it out loud a lot as well, so that I can kind of see if it flows as a sentence. Um but yeah, so I think it's more like that. It's just uh rewriting quite a few bits, but not like everything, just like the problem sort of areas. But with Stargazer, that ended up being more than I thought. Yeah, damn. Yeah, I was like, it could just be better. Like, I want it to be, it's the second book. I want it to be as good as it possibly, possibly can. Like perfectionist and you kicked in hardcore. Yeah. So my editing took so much longer than I thought. And I was like, oh my god, I need to send out ARK's help. Yeah, but yeah. Hey guys, did you know that as well as a writer and a podcaster, I'm also a writing mindset coach. I work with clients to help empower them to bust through their excuses and write, to allow them to own their own power because writing is such a transformational type of self-care. I have two ways you can work with me. The first is through my program by the same name, the writing apothecary. Here I have four offers: one, three, six, and twelve month coaching options. This is where we get down and dirty with your writing and we explore what you need. Each of the tiers are tailor-made to you and exactly what you are after. No coaching session is the same. Each of their tiers are limited in their numbers as I give my all to my clients, and I want to make sure that it's consistent and you get all of my dedication and attention. In these sessions, you also have access to editing and soundboarding and lots of additional support that isn't just our sessions that we meet up every fortnight. For all writing apothecary listeners, I'm giving an introductory 10% off your first booking with me. Head over to my website dreamingfoliolike.com forward slash work with me and book in a session with me. Or hit me up on my socials at Mandy Cont, which is M-A-N-D-I-K-O-N-T, and I can go ahead and slot you in. It's also important to know that I do have payment planned if it's needed and it's a case-by-case situation. This is something that I'm really passionate about, and I hope to hear from you soon. And until then, keep on writing, guys. I guess, like you mentioned that you'd you take a little bit of a break to um make your own art. Like, how does that, I guess, come about? Is it something that you, you know, sit down and be like, okay, cool, I know exactly what you know, XYZ looks like or how this scene kind of works, or is there a way that you kind of like, you know, how does that work? Because I'm such a like with words, like words for me, I'm just like they're there, I can see the whole movie. I I wish I could be able to put it into a physical like image. I'm just not good at drawing, but like I'm just always so like obsessed with the way that others can like make something like that come to life and it looks amazing. And your like artwork is so beautiful, your covers are stunning. So, like I want to know what's what goes on behind that. Yeah, um, a visual person. So I think when even while I'm like writing things, if I like imagine a certain scene, I'll go on Pinterest and I'll like find sort of like the aesthetic for that scene, and then that helps me get like the details down and stuff. So I think because of that, when it comes to actually drawing certain scenes, um, I think picking scenes to draw is hard, but like I see it's been like them all, yeah, exactly. And I'm like, also I don't have time for that. Stop being ridiculous. Um, so yeah, like I kind of will be like, okay, I know I want like one character art of each of the main characters, and then well, with Supping Over, I could kind of just go off vibes.
Speaker 2:There was a general story to tell, but I felt like I was able to do it how I wanted with no pressure or expectations. There was no real structure to how I wrote because it was more of a passion project more than anything else, and when I first wrote it, I kind of thought no one would read it. But with Stargazer, I had a storyline to follow, I had questions to answer, and I had people who wanted to read it and wanted to know what was going to happen next, and you know, who she was going to choose, how the wolves were gonna be more involved. There was a lot more to it that I had to think about. I had a basic idea of what I wanted to happen, but I really needed to flesh that out and become more of a planner. So I focused more on what I wanted, and there was a lot more organization in my chapters, and then from there the Panther side of me took over in the sense that I didn't always write chronologically. I wrote based on what I was feeling and tackled chapters like that. But with with Stargazer, I really did follow more of a guide. There was also a lot more thought put into how certain aspects were going to tie into the final book and how I could leave those breadcrumbs throughout the story and try to tell it in a way that would keep readers wanting more. The ending in particular was something I had to really analyze and figure out where I wanted to cut it. I still had that last chapter written really early, like I did supernova. Um, but the events before that last chapter, like the epilogue, I mulled over a lot. I moved things around and I played with the order of chapters to find something I was happy with that also left things on a good cliffhanger. And I needed to find the right balance and wanted to make sure book three would start with action quite quickly. So there was a whole section that was initially part of book two that I ended up cutting and moving to the third book. So yeah, a lot more thought went into every part of it. Whereas with Supernova, it didn't feel like I needed that level of criticism because the story was lighter and mostly setting things up and more just about the romance. Stargazer really focused on V's growth as well, and that needed to be factored in while making sure I was hitting that romance aspect that was so prevalent in Supernova. So I really had to just balance everything, and I was trying to make sure that the reader got more answers in regards to backstories and world building, and ensuring there was a lot more information about the knights and also the wolves. So I had a lot of fun with it, adding more plot in and letting that take a bit more of a focus, especially in the second half of the book, so that it was ready to flow into book three and start tying pieces together. I think book one was good practice, and I learnt a lot that made the process of writing sagas a lot more streamlined. But at the same time, writing a second book was definitely harder than I thought.
Speaker 1:It just felt it felt nice. It would like hick, like but yeah, I don't know. I I just I see it so clearly in my head. So then when it comes to actually drawing it out, it's just like it's nice to be able to get it out. I feel like if I was doing someone else, you know, it wouldn't be the same. But this is like straight from my brain, yeah, out onto my iPad. Um yeah, but when it comes to like drawing the covers, like I think very early on, like I have an idea of what I want them to look like. And I when I was starting the cover for the second book, I also like had an idea for the third book. So like I sketched them out like super, super so you have a draft sitting somewhere there of book three. I do, I do. I'm envious. I need to have a look after this interview, please. I'm sorry, it's literally like stick figures, but it's just like I want to see it. It's um, yeah, so it it just helps to sort of get it out um early while the ideas flow. Um, and then yeah, like I just sort of spend time drawing them. Um I tend to like draw whenever I feel like I've got writer's block and I'm like not yeah, like I kind of go between the two. So if I'm like switching from one creativity like creative brain to the other creative brain, which is I think that's such a huge like benefit because you've got the best of both worlds. Yeah, um it helps because otherwise I feel like I just get really stuck and like then I'll start procrastinating and I'm like, why am I doing this? So it just helps me ever switch to the other one and sort of I think it gets me more in the mindset as well. Like if I'm drawing out that scene, I then like have ideas for other things right, or like what's it called? Dialogue starts popping in my mind. And I'm like, oh so you're like, oh cool, I can stop this and go back to the writing and exactly. Yeah, that's cool. Okay, I guess what part of the process do you dislike the most and why? Um, it probably the editing. I mean, like, that's everyone's stock standard. They're like, it's the editing part, and I'm like, it's disgusting. It is, it is. It's it's really hard to be able to like tear apart your work and then like actually make those changes when like obviously when you've written it down the first time, like you said, you feel like you're perfect, exactly. So then it's like, oh, like, am I gonna change that? Like, I really like how that sounds, but like, oh, is this gonna be better? It's like really hard to just actually make those changes. Yeah, and I think reading your book that many times over just like I don't exactly, exactly. I didn't find that as much with supernova. With supernova, like maybe I didn't edit it as much as I needed to, or I don't know, didn't spend as much time on it because I didn't feel like I hated it. When I finished Stargazer, I was like, oh my god, get this book away from me. Like, I can't do that. Were you working on Stargazer before you got to like the endpoint? I don't know. I think I started writing in like July last year. Last year, and then I think I finished the whole process was like done in May. Yeah. April. April, May. Yeah. But then because I'm drawing at the same time, it's not like I'm just writing. Like my covers take like 30 hours, maybe longer, to draw. Um, and that's just like the main drawing, not putting the cover together. So, and then each of those pieces that I draw inside the book as well takes a while. So there'll be times when I'm literally not touching the story at all. And I think like I had a few months last month where I was doing commissions for other authors and stuff. So my writing was doing commissions, good girl. Not as much at the moment, but I did quite a few last year, which was nice. Yeah. Um so yeah, it's not like it's yeah, yeah. What about with um supernova? Did that take a lot of time to do as well? Or was that something that like because obviously the second book, it's you you're in the world already, but this the first book you're kind of setting the scene. Did it take longer? Was it less time? I think with supernova, I worked on it like very sporadically. I was working like a normal job and stuff like that. So I didn't really have time. And at that time, it was just sort of being written for me. I really didn't think I was gonna share it anywhere. But I see it in my head, I want to get it down. If I get it down, maybe I'll publish it. So a few might people might read it. Like that was sort of the mindset with it. And because of that, like I was very torn between do I want to do my art stuff or do I want to write in my spare time? But still always like a problem for me. Like I'm so indecisive and I'm like, do I write, do I draw? I don't know which one, which one? Yeah. And then I ended up neither. I'm just gonna procrastinate and scroll for a while instead. Um so yeah, like it took a long time because I was just writing literally whenever, but I don't know how long I was doing it for. It was probably like a year and a half before I like fully started working on it. But at that point, like I think it was was it last year? I don't know. I like ended up quitting my job and being like, I'm gonna focus on commissions and freelancing and having a little Etsy store, and I wanted to do like so many other things. Um, and when I did that, I ended up doing a bit of the art stuff, but then focusing on the book. Yeah, and from that point, it came together quite quickly. I think it was like February to April. Yeah. And I got kind of all of that done. I got the book finished, I did my editing, I did my formatting, learned how to format because I'm a person who has control issues. So I like format myself on like Word doc and try to add all my like you know that you can use like Govellum and like Atticus and stuff. I don't like them. I want to do it myself and make my life difficult. Dennis, why? But you know what? I'm so proud of myself because I know how to format from scratch on Microsoft Word. That's amazing. So amazing. Love that. And now I just like use that as a template for like Stargazer and I'll do the same for book three, and I just pop it in and make those edits. But like when I was figuring out how to do this is intense. But no. How many bot how many bottles of wine did you consume? It was probably more coffee. There was a lot of coffee. Gosh. Yeah. Oh gosh. Do you have any kind of like journaling practice or some sort of writing routine that kind of supports you through the novels, whether it's, you know, obviously because you do the drawing as well. Um, does it come hand in hand with that, or is it you just don't have one? I don't really have one. I don't. Um, I think be like previously in life, like I used to journal a lot more, but I think that was before I actually started writing. Like, I feel like I almost use my writing now as like a way to get out my emotions, how I'm feeling. And like I put a lot of that into the pages. Um, yeah, I remember when I was like a teenager, I used to like journal to like whenever things would happen, whenever things happen in my life, like family issues and stuff like that, I would write it as a journal but a story, like as if it was a book. Yeah. And I think that is what got me into writing in the first place. But now, as a as someone who spends so much time doing everything else, I don't, I don't, I don't journal. That's good. That's okay. Um, what's your favorite part of the writing process?
Speaker 2:My favorite part has to be the actual writing. So I guess that flow state of getting words down in the first draft, it's so surreal seeing them just appear on the screen as I type, and the words and scenes sometimes just feel like they come out of nowhere. There's oftentimes I look back at it and I'm literally like, where on earth did that come from? It's such a creative release, and I do it because I truly love it, especially when your characters sometimes feel like they write themselves or you just picture scenes and dialogue so clearly, and then you have to rush to get it out of your head and onto that page. Um, that feeling of just letting my fingers flow over the keyboard and sometimes trying to make them actually keep up with my brain is kind of crazy and kind of amazing, and seeing it unfold is just so magical. When things just click into place, there's not really a better feeling than that. Like it's definitely my favorite part of the process, just getting to getting to write it all down, getting to get it from my head down onto a page and on paper, I guess, and making it like this tangible thing.
Speaker 1:In all of that, how do you describe your writing processes in just five words? I actually like I thought about this. I'm like, I need to write this down because I'm like, I'm not gonna know, but I said chaotic, intuitive, therapeutic, sporadic, and visual. I like that. So cool. I love everyone's almost been like it's chaotic, and I'm like, I love that. I love that everyone's writing process always is so chaotic because it is like we don't know what we're doing, we're just kind of banging it out and hoping for the best. Exactly. And I love that though, like that's the beauty of it, I think. Absolutely. I think, and that's the fun, that's the fun part about like chatting to other writers and being able to be like, okay, well, what does your process look like? And then they break it down at the end of the day. Everybody's is as chaotic because it's all different for all of us, but it's just a matter of being like what works for us and how it works the best. Exactly. Like there's it's one thing to get your ideas down, but then like making those ideas a cohesive unit is like it's so hard for people like us that are like constantly in our heads. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Okay, so I guess um, what advice would you give to budding writers who are trying to find what their writing process looks like to them? You just gotta you like trap the rest as you go. Um, I think, well, for me specifically, like the fear of not doing things properly and like that imposter syndrome and just feeling like, oh, like if I'm not doing it right, might as well not do it. I think that put me off writing for a long time and definitely put me off like the process of actually trying to get like publish my book because I was just like, well, if it's not going to be perfect, then like there's no point in having it out there. But I think you just gotta, like for me, it worked to just go with the flow to like write and then figure out everything as I go, and then you learn so much the more you do it with each book that you do. Like, as I've said throughout this whole thing, like I sort of have been able to hone in on that process and figure out what works for me. But it is very much trial and error at the start. And I already think that if you like, I'm like super shy and I hate asking for help, and like it like I don't know, like it you for it freaks me out a lot. But at the start of my process, I found like other authors and stuff that I felt comfortable enough to message and just like ask them about their process and what works for them, and I think that was really helpful. Um, but yeah, just like you have to push yourself out of your comfort zone a little bit, which is not always fun, but it pays off in the end. Absolutely. I think it's interesting that the writing process changes for every single book because it's like what you think works for the first one works just for that one because you don't have to then rely on everything else for the rest of the books. Whereas book two is so different, and then book three again is different again. So it's just it's cool. Yeah. And for me for book two as well, it was quite like significantly longer than book one. So I think that also changed the process because I've sort of learned to work smarter and not. It's a chunky girl.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she is.
Speaker 1:Was not expecting that. I love it. What is your favorite piece of writing advice from one of the greats? Um, like you know, there's quite a few really cool um writing quotes that famous authors have said. Is there anything that has stuck with you and jumped out whenever you think of writing in general? Yeah, yeah. Well, I've got like that one from Stephen King that if you want to be a writer, you must do two things above all others. Read a lot and write a lot. There's no way around these two things, and I'm aware of it, no shortcut. I love that. One because it justifies my book by game of time. Yes. But also because I feel like, you know, when you're writing, like you can put so much pressure on yourself. Um, I think that's what makes you a better writer. You like to learn so much, and your writing style changes and adapts. And even between Supernova and Stargazer, like the amount of books that I read in that time, I felt like made Stargazer and my writing so much better. Yeah. Um, so yeah, it really does. Like you you just you need to read, and that teaches you how to write. So yeah. I always have this thing in my head when I'm just like, I don't have time to read. And then I think of Stephen King that says, like, you know, if you don't have time to read, you don't have time to write. So therefore you're not a writer. And I'm like, okay, okay. Yeah. Everything is research, it's all research. Absolutely. And it's tax deductible eventually. Exactly. But it's also just nice to like, oh, I was gonna say, turn your brain off to like read, but I don't know, my brain doesn't turn off because I'm still like, oh my god, that's written so beautifully. I just read and I'm like, okay, make sure you turn off the like um higher education brain, which looks at things at a different level. Turn off the writer brain because yes, okay, sometimes the words aren't correct, and just read, but sometimes I'm like, nope, I can't. And I'm like, why am I reading this? Yeah, it's hard, but yeah, I definitely think that reading it makes me feel better about spending that time to actually read. Because I'm like, well, I'm not like wasting time, like this is this is what I do, and I love it. So being able to like disappear into other people's worlds is so amazing and also helps you. So we win. Exactly. And if you could wave a magic wand and have one part of the process come out perfectly, which would it be? That is so hard. Because like I feel like every part of the process, it makes your book what it is. Like, I'd love to be like, oh my god, it'd be amazing to have like a perfect story, but also the fact that it's imperfect is what makes it my story and what makes it beautiful. So I think putting that aside, it'd probably be like editing or like proofreading, like knowing like if I could just magically wave a wand and like all the comments are in the exact right spot, that'd be amazing. But I would also love, like, not really part of the writing process, but like marketing-wise, like it would be great to just be able to crack the code. Yeah, I love doing it. Let's go viral. God, please, can we please? Like, I studied marketing in uni, that's like what my degree was, and I still am like, I don't bloody know. Like, you just it's here's my thing. Read it, love it, please. Just share it, do whatever you need to do. Like, I spend so much time making content, and I actually love doing that. Like, that was what my previous jobs were and stuff like that. Like, I enjoy doing it. That's great. I love it. Thank you. I try, I do so well. I'm like, I want someone to do my content for me because I'm like it's too hard. Oh, it it is hard, like it requires so much time. I can spend so much time that I could be writing, making content. And then when you post it and it like gets no. You don't do anything, you're like so like just disheartening. So if you had to crack the code and go viral would be great. Yeah, amazing. Well, where can our lovely listeners find you and your books? Um, and do you have any events or anything coming up soon? I so I'm on Instagram and I think my Insta J A Jude. Um, and I think I have like, I don't know, if you want more behind the scenes, then like my TikTok's the place to go. And then I think like my Instagram, I'm on it more, and I'm like more like connected to people, but it's a lot more like vibes, aesthetic, that sort of stuff. Um, my books are on Amazon at the moment. We're trying to get them on Ingram. Trying to get them on Ingram. We're in the process, it's happening. Um, and uh also free on Kindle Unlimited, and I've got like signed copies and like a few bits and pieces, like character art I've done and stuff on Etsy as well. Trying to get her website, it's also in the process, it's so hard to say I started this thinking that I'm not gonna share it with anybody, so like it's so like I'm like, oh okay, we'll we will try to get it more widespread, but I'm scared. Why are you scared? The book's out there, you've done events, like girl, come on. I know, I know. No, it's just now it's like more the fact that I'm in the flow of writing book three. Then I'm like, I don't want to stop to like do all these other things, but then when like you just have to take a day, take just be like, I'm gonna do this on one day and then this on another day. I need to, I definitely need to, but my brain doesn't work like that. I'll wake up that day and I'll be like, I'm gonna do admin, and then like the best scene that I've ever written will pop into my head, and I'm like, oh my god. Story of my life. I'm like, okay, cool, we've got to update our website. No, we're not. Um, in terms of events, I don't actually have anything fully set up. I've got one next year that I think is in August. Umie bookworm. We do. Yay! Yay. Um, but I'll kind of see. I'm gonna probably do some more research, see what else is out there. Yeah. Um I never thought I'd go to events. I don't know. Like I just never thought that you'd get your novel published, like you know, this is all the stuff that goes with it. Exactly, exactly. But it's it's really nice and there's so much fun. So yeah, we'll definitely be trying to do more. Yay, it's good. Well, thank you so much for chatting to us, and we wish you good luck with the next book. And we can't wait to um, I guess, see it and hear about it very soon. Amazing. Thank you so much. This is so fun. Love being able to chat about it. I'm glad I'll talk to you soon. Thanks for listening to the Writing Apothecary Podcast. To find show notes and more information, head over to my website, which is just dreamingfoliolake.com slash podcast, where you'll find show notes, resources, worksheets, and more info about the podcast. You can also follow us on Instagram by just searching at the Writing Apothecary. I'd also love it if you guys took the time to leave a review or even write it just on your platform. It'll help other creators and writers find our community and help them get their writing practice and their creativity back on track.